Monday, April 09, 2007
Oh No-- Now the Unitarian Universalists Are After Me!
Even though I tried to be fair, it seems that I have angered Waco's U.U. population. A large mob of them came over and burned a big question mark on my lawn!
Padump-dum. No, really they just broke into my car and left some "Heavy D. and the Boyz" tapes and four Slim Jims.
Padump-dum. No, really they just broke into my car and left some "Heavy D. and the Boyz" tapes and four Slim Jims.
Comments:
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Burn a question mark on your lawn... that is a good one! I am SURPRISED I have not heard that one before...
Don't worry Osler. Its almost Summer. They do not have church in the summer.
Don't worry Osler. Its almost Summer. They do not have church in the summer.
# posted by 
: 5:04 AM
: 5:04 AM
Is that true? They just skip the whole summer?
And B-Mac: I do have an extra Slim Jim. Plus, it looks like they also left some crackers and a "WWAD" wristband.
And B-Mac: I do have an extra Slim Jim. Plus, it looks like they also left some crackers and a "WWAD" wristband.
Yes No church in the summer....hence when we came back in the fall, we had the welcome back "apple and cheese communion."
I guess maybe SOME Unitarian congregations might have summer church...I do not know of any... maybe there are some "Orthodox" Unitarians out there..
WWAD - THAT was also a good one.
I guess maybe SOME Unitarian congregations might have summer church...I do not know of any... maybe there are some "Orthodox" Unitarians out there..
WWAD - THAT was also a good one.
# posted by : 12:56 PM
: 12:56 PM
A friend of mine, who is also a fan of the often crass but funny ONION, gave me as a gift a yellow wristband yesterday. I thought it was another lance Armstrong one but instead it was yellow and said "Cheat to Win."
It had the Onion symbol on it.
I SECRETLY thought it was funny.
It had the Onion symbol on it.
I SECRETLY thought it was funny.
# posted by : 12:59 PM
: 12:59 PM
Tyd,
I enjoy reading about your little struggle here with how to raise your child, wanting him to get some sort of sense of what a faith based life can be about. Here is my two cents worth. Only you get a special bargain today. It’s free, and, worth every penny.
Clearly, your faith does not yet have even a shape for you, and I think that you need to develop what that looks like in your own relationship with your husband before you try to inculcate Spencer with anything that has a chance of making sense to him as he lives and matures in his own life.
I’m not saying that there is anything “off” between you and your hubby. But a little time for the both of you together church shopping with an open mind to the happy balance you are trying to achieve in your own walk may help. Keep in mind that churches on the whole are political animals and they tend to reflect the personality (and sometimes “official views” on current events to the great detriment of the congregation) of their Pastors or spiritual leaders rather than a vanilla presentation of the liturgy. That can be very off-putting. It is sometimes hard for Clergy and other professionals to limit or suppress their passions (just ask Osler a sentencing question and see if he can’t get through the answer without a reference to presenting a paper on Pontius Pilate.) This tendency can make it difficult for the outsider to get a grasp on the really good things many churches have to offer.
I wouldn’t worry too much about what God looks like. I’m pretty sure that Jesus didn’t have light skin and pretty, light brown hair, contrary to almost every painting that’s ever been done. It is the “feel” that’s important -- and the covenant that is between you and whoever (or whatever) you believe God to be.
Fact finding in a religious sense is often times a meaningless exercise in a faith based world, but leaving other’s opinions aside and finding a footing that makes sense for the life you want to pass on to your progeny is not only worthwhile, it is the only way to provide a world for Spencer that can be totally reconciled.
The airline industry has the right idea: When the oxygen masks drop from the overhead compartments, first fit yourself, then tend to your children…they cannot survive without you. You and hubby should ground yourselves before you try to provide some footing for Spencer. It can’t be that hard to do, you are already committed to each other. In faith, there is certainly room for common ground.
I enjoy reading about your little struggle here with how to raise your child, wanting him to get some sort of sense of what a faith based life can be about. Here is my two cents worth. Only you get a special bargain today. It’s free, and, worth every penny.
Clearly, your faith does not yet have even a shape for you, and I think that you need to develop what that looks like in your own relationship with your husband before you try to inculcate Spencer with anything that has a chance of making sense to him as he lives and matures in his own life.
I’m not saying that there is anything “off” between you and your hubby. But a little time for the both of you together church shopping with an open mind to the happy balance you are trying to achieve in your own walk may help. Keep in mind that churches on the whole are political animals and they tend to reflect the personality (and sometimes “official views” on current events to the great detriment of the congregation) of their Pastors or spiritual leaders rather than a vanilla presentation of the liturgy. That can be very off-putting. It is sometimes hard for Clergy and other professionals to limit or suppress their passions (just ask Osler a sentencing question and see if he can’t get through the answer without a reference to presenting a paper on Pontius Pilate.) This tendency can make it difficult for the outsider to get a grasp on the really good things many churches have to offer.
I wouldn’t worry too much about what God looks like. I’m pretty sure that Jesus didn’t have light skin and pretty, light brown hair, contrary to almost every painting that’s ever been done. It is the “feel” that’s important -- and the covenant that is between you and whoever (or whatever) you believe God to be.
Fact finding in a religious sense is often times a meaningless exercise in a faith based world, but leaving other’s opinions aside and finding a footing that makes sense for the life you want to pass on to your progeny is not only worthwhile, it is the only way to provide a world for Spencer that can be totally reconciled.
The airline industry has the right idea: When the oxygen masks drop from the overhead compartments, first fit yourself, then tend to your children…they cannot survive without you. You and hubby should ground yourselves before you try to provide some footing for Spencer. It can’t be that hard to do, you are already committed to each other. In faith, there is certainly room for common ground.
# posted by : 2:51 PM
: 2:51 PM
Anonymous, you made some very good points.
My husband is very grounded in his faith though, very sure of it. He grew up Presbyterian and his father is a minister. His parents are both retired now, but they both work full time for free like 95 hours a week at the church. His mom works in the office, and his Dad is on the board of the preschool and is heavily involved with the Youth groups.
Bill has no doubts of his faith or what he would like Spencer to believe. He has not attended church since he left home after college, but he prays a lot and has never stopped being a person of faith. He just never lived in a permanent place before now, and so he did not try to really find a church to go to. Now we know we are staying here in Canby, OR so we are looking for that.
I just have decide if I am willing to sort of "go with the flow" at his church for Spencer's sake, or rather, do my own thing with the UUs and let he and Spencer do their thing.
My only concern is that Bill, right now, will not set foot into a Unitarian church for any reason, and this disturbs me. I do not like that quality in him, and I do not want Spencer to be this way. Bill feels as if they do not stand for anything or something like this and it is a place where you cannot worship because there is no God there.
I was not allowed to marry Bill in the Unitarian church I grew up in, because they refused to go inside of it. They called the Unitarians "The Elk's Club of Religions."
I want the best of both worlds for Spencer for him to have a faith , but also to have an open heart and be a little more accepting of new people and ideas than Bill is. I want him to be able to find solace and a relationship with his God as he grows up , but not to be so... sort of what I view to be as a little closed minded.
I mean, my In Laws are a perfect example. They do not hate gay people, they say. In fact, to prove this to me, they enthusiastically tell me about this program their church has for gay people that is really "making a difference." Its called something like "One at a Time" and what they do is try to help gay people by using religion to make them not gay anymore.
I was like "Uhmmmm you do WHAT????" I thought this was INSANE!!!! but then I learned that they see being gay as a choice a person is making, and that the person can just "change back."
But then, for me.. I see person's sexuality as just like whatever a "Who cares?" kind of thing. Like WHO CARES if they want to get married? WHO CARES? This freaks Bill's parents out. I mean maybe I do not know enough gay people, but the ones I have known never once tried to "recruit" me or something like this. They lived their lives, you know?
Isn't there a place a church we can find that will NOT teach him to be this way? SO that when he gets to college or some place, and he meets some gay people he is not going to be mean to them or run other way, or try to help them by "changing them back."
I worry about these dumb kinds of things. Hopefully we can find a church, Bill and I will where we both can feel comfortable, and we can both find some kind of a spiritual home. I hope so.
My husband is very grounded in his faith though, very sure of it. He grew up Presbyterian and his father is a minister. His parents are both retired now, but they both work full time for free like 95 hours a week at the church. His mom works in the office, and his Dad is on the board of the preschool and is heavily involved with the Youth groups.
Bill has no doubts of his faith or what he would like Spencer to believe. He has not attended church since he left home after college, but he prays a lot and has never stopped being a person of faith. He just never lived in a permanent place before now, and so he did not try to really find a church to go to. Now we know we are staying here in Canby, OR so we are looking for that.
I just have decide if I am willing to sort of "go with the flow" at his church for Spencer's sake, or rather, do my own thing with the UUs and let he and Spencer do their thing.
My only concern is that Bill, right now, will not set foot into a Unitarian church for any reason, and this disturbs me. I do not like that quality in him, and I do not want Spencer to be this way. Bill feels as if they do not stand for anything or something like this and it is a place where you cannot worship because there is no God there.
I was not allowed to marry Bill in the Unitarian church I grew up in, because they refused to go inside of it. They called the Unitarians "The Elk's Club of Religions."
I want the best of both worlds for Spencer for him to have a faith , but also to have an open heart and be a little more accepting of new people and ideas than Bill is. I want him to be able to find solace and a relationship with his God as he grows up , but not to be so... sort of what I view to be as a little closed minded.
I mean, my In Laws are a perfect example. They do not hate gay people, they say. In fact, to prove this to me, they enthusiastically tell me about this program their church has for gay people that is really "making a difference." Its called something like "One at a Time" and what they do is try to help gay people by using religion to make them not gay anymore.
I was like "Uhmmmm you do WHAT????" I thought this was INSANE!!!! but then I learned that they see being gay as a choice a person is making, and that the person can just "change back."
But then, for me.. I see person's sexuality as just like whatever a "Who cares?" kind of thing. Like WHO CARES if they want to get married? WHO CARES? This freaks Bill's parents out. I mean maybe I do not know enough gay people, but the ones I have known never once tried to "recruit" me or something like this. They lived their lives, you know?
Isn't there a place a church we can find that will NOT teach him to be this way? SO that when he gets to college or some place, and he meets some gay people he is not going to be mean to them or run other way, or try to help them by "changing them back."
I worry about these dumb kinds of things. Hopefully we can find a church, Bill and I will where we both can feel comfortable, and we can both find some kind of a spiritual home. I hope so.
# posted by : 4:16 PM
: 4:16 PM
tyd,
my parents were jewish and christian.
i went to church every sunday, but i only went to the jewish temple on the major holidays.
just as a natural consequence of going to a christian church i became a christian- they were a lot more aggresive about converting the young than the jews are.
looking back i don't think i ever felt upset that both of my parents didn't go to church together.
although after my conversion to christianity i became concerned about the "eternal destination" of my non-christian parent. i don't really blame the church for that; it was just again a natural consequence of being in a religion that is tied to absolutes.
ultimately i think i was raised by my parents and not the church. i learned love, justice, compassion from them. it was influenced by religion, but my religion didn't force me into believing one thing above another.
it seems as though you are genuinely concerned about the moral growth of your child. regardless of what church your child goes to and who goes to that church with your child, that concern will ultimately instill a strong character in the child.
my parents were jewish and christian.
i went to church every sunday, but i only went to the jewish temple on the major holidays.
just as a natural consequence of going to a christian church i became a christian- they were a lot more aggresive about converting the young than the jews are.
looking back i don't think i ever felt upset that both of my parents didn't go to church together.
although after my conversion to christianity i became concerned about the "eternal destination" of my non-christian parent. i don't really blame the church for that; it was just again a natural consequence of being in a religion that is tied to absolutes.
ultimately i think i was raised by my parents and not the church. i learned love, justice, compassion from them. it was influenced by religion, but my religion didn't force me into believing one thing above another.
it seems as though you are genuinely concerned about the moral growth of your child. regardless of what church your child goes to and who goes to that church with your child, that concern will ultimately instill a strong character in the child.
# posted by : 5:01 PM
: 5:01 PM
Tyd,
The first Anon here again. I can certainly understand the perspective: how despairing your feeling must be around Bill’s parents. It is clear from your description that the tenets of their faith are proscribed and a little patronizing. Of this, I am always suspect. From my own perspective, I hate it when people want to interpret the bible for me. If indeed it is a religion for everyone, then we on our own ought to be able to understand what the bible holds for us. It is our public worship groups that help us in our interpretation and help hold us accountable to our beliefs. I think that part is important.
I am not so closed minded to believe that the Bible (Koran, Book of Mormon, Sayings of Confucius, or Chairman Mao’s little red book, insert your faith reference book here) is the only faith sustenance one needs as fundamentalist Islamics do, but a religion for all people must not consist of secret handshakes and nudge nudge wink wink special circumstances for inclusion. Find a church that parks their judgmental attitudes at the door – that is really some One else’s responsibility.
The first Anon here again. I can certainly understand the perspective: how despairing your feeling must be around Bill’s parents. It is clear from your description that the tenets of their faith are proscribed and a little patronizing. Of this, I am always suspect. From my own perspective, I hate it when people want to interpret the bible for me. If indeed it is a religion for everyone, then we on our own ought to be able to understand what the bible holds for us. It is our public worship groups that help us in our interpretation and help hold us accountable to our beliefs. I think that part is important.
I am not so closed minded to believe that the Bible (Koran, Book of Mormon, Sayings of Confucius, or Chairman Mao’s little red book, insert your faith reference book here) is the only faith sustenance one needs as fundamentalist Islamics do, but a religion for all people must not consist of secret handshakes and nudge nudge wink wink special circumstances for inclusion. Find a church that parks their judgmental attitudes at the door – that is really some One else’s responsibility.
# posted by : 5:38 PM
: 5:38 PM
Slim Jims?
I'm no theology expert, but I think Ralph Waldo Emerson and the Transcendentalists were trying to find "something" or some way to mix Dei-ism and religion when the Unitarian Church got started, but from the descriptions, it sounds like the Unitarians kind of wandered.
But the UU church sounds better than no church at all. I have relatives who get a lot out of it. It may be one of those things that benefit you most if you put something into it yourself. Then again, that's probably true about any church.
I'm no theology expert, but I think Ralph Waldo Emerson and the Transcendentalists were trying to find "something" or some way to mix Dei-ism and religion when the Unitarian Church got started, but from the descriptions, it sounds like the Unitarians kind of wandered.
But the UU church sounds better than no church at all. I have relatives who get a lot out of it. It may be one of those things that benefit you most if you put something into it yourself. Then again, that's probably true about any church.
# posted by : 5:52 PM
: 5:52 PM
Slim Jims?
I'm no theology expert, but I think Ralph Waldo Emerson and the Transcendentalists were trying to find "something" or some way to mix Dei-ism and religion when the Unitarian Church got started, but from the descriptions, it sounds like the Unitarians kind of wandered.
But the UU church sounds better than no church at all. I have relatives who get a lot out of it. It may be one of those things that benefit you most if you put something into it yourself. Then again, that's probably true about any church.
I'm no theology expert, but I think Ralph Waldo Emerson and the Transcendentalists were trying to find "something" or some way to mix Dei-ism and religion when the Unitarian Church got started, but from the descriptions, it sounds like the Unitarians kind of wandered.
But the UU church sounds better than no church at all. I have relatives who get a lot out of it. It may be one of those things that benefit you most if you put something into it yourself. Then again, that's probably true about any church.
# posted by : 5:52 PM
: 5:52 PM
Tyd...
I read Osler's blog regularly and I've glanced through your postings. These recent ones, however, really struck me.
If you knew me, you'd know I have an opinion on everything...and I'm right on all of them! (ha!) However, the only thing I'm really positive of is that I don't (and no one else does either) know the ultimate truths of the universe.
I grew up in a liberal Southern Baptist Church (yes, there are such things and were way back then). I loved my youth group and am so glad I had that group of friends in that environment and church community. It gave me a safe place to mature and was open and loving.
But as a young kid, I'm going to say 5 or 6, I remember lying in bed thinking, "Why would anyone want to live forever?" What a strange concept. That you believe a certain thing and you get to live forever. It sounded awful to me!
And why not be a good person because that's the best way to make the world work? Why instead be a "good" person because it gets you eternal life? Stange motivation to me.
I had a conversation a few years ago with a student from a private Texas college. We somehow got onto religion. I said, "It drives me crazy that people thing you have to be Republican to be Christian." He said, "Well, most Christians are Republican." I stopped and thought...then said, "If Jesus himself came today and saw the mulitmillion-dollar 'activity centers' built by today's churches, he's say, 'Well done! Forget the poor people, you have a great rec center!'" He quickly agreed.
Anyway, I digress. My suggestion would be to find a church that you can feel comfortable with Spencer. One that teaches him to see many possibilities. Have discussions at the dinner table. Live your life as an example to your son. If Bill won't set foot in the UU Church, then he won't. Spencer will be curious at some point. It's not a "my way or his way" throw-down-the-gauntlet situation.
Best of luck to you. I have faith (yes, faith) that you and Bill and Spencer will be A-OK.
I read Osler's blog regularly and I've glanced through your postings. These recent ones, however, really struck me.
If you knew me, you'd know I have an opinion on everything...and I'm right on all of them! (ha!) However, the only thing I'm really positive of is that I don't (and no one else does either) know the ultimate truths of the universe.
I grew up in a liberal Southern Baptist Church (yes, there are such things and were way back then). I loved my youth group and am so glad I had that group of friends in that environment and church community. It gave me a safe place to mature and was open and loving.
But as a young kid, I'm going to say 5 or 6, I remember lying in bed thinking, "Why would anyone want to live forever?" What a strange concept. That you believe a certain thing and you get to live forever. It sounded awful to me!
And why not be a good person because that's the best way to make the world work? Why instead be a "good" person because it gets you eternal life? Stange motivation to me.
I had a conversation a few years ago with a student from a private Texas college. We somehow got onto religion. I said, "It drives me crazy that people thing you have to be Republican to be Christian." He said, "Well, most Christians are Republican." I stopped and thought...then said, "If Jesus himself came today and saw the mulitmillion-dollar 'activity centers' built by today's churches, he's say, 'Well done! Forget the poor people, you have a great rec center!'" He quickly agreed.
Anyway, I digress. My suggestion would be to find a church that you can feel comfortable with Spencer. One that teaches him to see many possibilities. Have discussions at the dinner table. Live your life as an example to your son. If Bill won't set foot in the UU Church, then he won't. Spencer will be curious at some point. It's not a "my way or his way" throw-down-the-gauntlet situation.
Best of luck to you. I have faith (yes, faith) that you and Bill and Spencer will be A-OK.
# posted by : 9:33 PM
: 9:33 PM
I appreciate all of the thought and care that went into all of your posts!!! I think we are on the right track, finally, in looking for a welcoming place where we will all feel good about attending, and a place where we feel we have something to contribute. I am not going to try and rule out any one religion, just sort of go by our instincts after attending a few of them. It may take some time, but I will keep you posted.
I try hard to be the best parent I can to Spencer, though he will never have the material advantages I had growing up. My parents had more money than Bill and I ever will, as my Dad was a surgeon and I am not.. but they also were pretty checked out of life. SO hopefully, though he will not be going to Cranbrook and all of that, he will at least have TWO attentive parents that will love and care for him the best way they possibly can. I had like 1/3 of one... I would have traded everything for this growing up. I guess this is why I obsess all the time about if I am doing the right things with him. I came to this parenthood thing very late, and I read all of these books all of the time and try hard to figure it all out.
But enough of all of this Shalom In The Home stuff hahaha. OSLER is HUNGRY!!!!!
I try hard to be the best parent I can to Spencer, though he will never have the material advantages I had growing up. My parents had more money than Bill and I ever will, as my Dad was a surgeon and I am not.. but they also were pretty checked out of life. SO hopefully, though he will not be going to Cranbrook and all of that, he will at least have TWO attentive parents that will love and care for him the best way they possibly can. I had like 1/3 of one... I would have traded everything for this growing up. I guess this is why I obsess all the time about if I am doing the right things with him. I came to this parenthood thing very late, and I read all of these books all of the time and try hard to figure it all out.
But enough of all of this Shalom In The Home stuff hahaha. OSLER is HUNGRY!!!!!
# posted by : 11:36 PM
: 11:36 PM
Tyd:
Sorry to chime in late... from your own first comment to Os re: Easter...
"Unitarianism was good and I am proud of it but it offered me no solace or comfort or just much of anything growing up. I would like [my son] to live a different way."
If, indeed, UU offered you "no solace or comfort or just much of anything," why might it be the place to start your faith journey?
My own faith journey has been long and winding, full of ups and downs, and I've managed it in fits and starts (the present time being among the more fitful). I do not profess to know all the answers by any means; I try above all else to "live and let live."
There are all kinds of things I could offer here, but I won't because they will sound trite and preachy. But there are two things I have learned about myself and about the God of my understanding in the years I've been wrestling with this whole faith thing (and with myself in the process:
1) Without God, I can't;
2) Without me, God won't.
Sorry to chime in late... from your own first comment to Os re: Easter...
"Unitarianism was good and I am proud of it but it offered me no solace or comfort or just much of anything growing up. I would like [my son] to live a different way."
If, indeed, UU offered you "no solace or comfort or just much of anything," why might it be the place to start your faith journey?
My own faith journey has been long and winding, full of ups and downs, and I've managed it in fits and starts (the present time being among the more fitful). I do not profess to know all the answers by any means; I try above all else to "live and let live."
There are all kinds of things I could offer here, but I won't because they will sound trite and preachy. But there are two things I have learned about myself and about the God of my understanding in the years I've been wrestling with this whole faith thing (and with myself in the process:
1) Without God, I can't;
2) Without me, God won't.
Er, "(and with myself)".
I was like this even before I read "Eats, Shoots and Leaves." My kids call me the Grammar Cop.
I was also the guy in chorus who used to raise his hand and say, "Excuse me, maestro, but the sopranos sang an E-flat there, instead of an E-natural." It's a wonder I've lasted 22 years in this business!
I was like this even before I read "Eats, Shoots and Leaves." My kids call me the Grammar Cop.
I was also the guy in chorus who used to raise his hand and say, "Excuse me, maestro, but the sopranos sang an E-flat there, instead of an E-natural." It's a wonder I've lasted 22 years in this business!
You know what is kind of unusual? The group of men I know who have had the most interesting faith journeys were those in my fraternity, like IPLG and TallTenor. I remember, along with all the other stuff, having that be something that we talked about, as something that was important. Well, that and Harry Buffalo. Anyways, I think the faith lives of college students is underappreciated-- the mainstream view is that they need ministers who are going to explain everything, but I'm not sure that is the right path.
In the end, it seems like the relationship a person has with whomever or whatever they refer to as God is something very individual and personal.
That is a GOOD QUESTION... like why would I want to go back to the Unitarians if it offered me not a lot growing up?
I had never thought of this. I have to think about this. I liked that people at my church. I liked also that it was so open to new ideas and people, but also very reflective and just I don't know. Maybe I LIKED not knowing. But then. my mom got sick and all of this other stuff and I sort of needed something more. Suddenly not knowing or whatever was not good enough. I needed to know why this was happening to her, where she would go when she died, what would happen to her after this. I had all of these questions and the Unitarians did not have the answers. I never got those answers form other churches really either so in the end I have no idea.
SO why would I want to re enter that? I wonder if it has something to do with my personality. Maybe I like to be sort of NOT in the MAINSTREAM... I grew up in this really conservative town that was supposed to be perfect and gorgeous and really kind of I dunno....Leave it to Beaver. A lot of people were in to conformity. For a lot of families it was like this, I guess, but for me it was like this illusion. I started summer camp when I was 8 years old and went away for 6 weeks at a time every summer after that. I got used to being away from Grosse Pointe, and I kind of liked it. After that time I could not wait to leave there, not because I hated it sooooo much, but just because I knew that it just was not my I don't know - not my element.
I guess I like life when its not so perfect, when the flaws are a little visible, and when not everyone knows all of the answers. The neurotic part of me always strives for the perfection I grew up with, knowing that I will never achieve it.
Thus this is why I think that if I had to be a person on the Mary Tyler Moore show, I would be the love child resulting from Ted Baxter and Sue Anne Nivens... at once I am a little domestic, a little dopey, a little sarcastic, a little nutty, but ultimately terribly good looking and charming......
Yah, that's me.
That is a GOOD QUESTION... like why would I want to go back to the Unitarians if it offered me not a lot growing up?
I had never thought of this. I have to think about this. I liked that people at my church. I liked also that it was so open to new ideas and people, but also very reflective and just I don't know. Maybe I LIKED not knowing. But then. my mom got sick and all of this other stuff and I sort of needed something more. Suddenly not knowing or whatever was not good enough. I needed to know why this was happening to her, where she would go when she died, what would happen to her after this. I had all of these questions and the Unitarians did not have the answers. I never got those answers form other churches really either so in the end I have no idea.
SO why would I want to re enter that? I wonder if it has something to do with my personality. Maybe I like to be sort of NOT in the MAINSTREAM... I grew up in this really conservative town that was supposed to be perfect and gorgeous and really kind of I dunno....Leave it to Beaver. A lot of people were in to conformity. For a lot of families it was like this, I guess, but for me it was like this illusion. I started summer camp when I was 8 years old and went away for 6 weeks at a time every summer after that. I got used to being away from Grosse Pointe, and I kind of liked it. After that time I could not wait to leave there, not because I hated it sooooo much, but just because I knew that it just was not my I don't know - not my element.
I guess I like life when its not so perfect, when the flaws are a little visible, and when not everyone knows all of the answers. The neurotic part of me always strives for the perfection I grew up with, knowing that I will never achieve it.
Thus this is why I think that if I had to be a person on the Mary Tyler Moore show, I would be the love child resulting from Ted Baxter and Sue Anne Nivens... at once I am a little domestic, a little dopey, a little sarcastic, a little nutty, but ultimately terribly good looking and charming......
Yah, that's me.
# posted by : 12:17 PM
: 12:17 PM
Tyd,
The first Anon again. You are married to a PK and you live in Oregon for goodness sakes. There is no way else you could be.
The first Anon again. You are married to a PK and you live in Oregon for goodness sakes. There is no way else you could be.
# posted by : 12:41 PM
: 12:41 PM
Os, I agree totally. One of the coolest things about faith is the struggle to achieve it... I think it's much better to question, to doubt, to probe, to inquire, to seek, than to be told or have things explained.
When my kids ask me questions about faith, I answer with, "Well, what I believe is... ." This to me seems much better than claiming to have the answers based on some other authority, because it can lead to a discussion about *why* I believe what I do -- this, I think, is the way to set them on their own faith journeys.
I also find it interesting that my faith as it's evolved has colored my politics: The ethos of "live and let live" is why I now consider myself a libertarian (note the lower-case "l").
BTW, "faith journey" is a term I first heard used back in the 'burg, at the CSA services I attended during my last two years there. I like this term very much.
When my kids ask me questions about faith, I answer with, "Well, what I believe is... ." This to me seems much better than claiming to have the answers based on some other authority, because it can lead to a discussion about *why* I believe what I do -- this, I think, is the way to set them on their own faith journeys.
I also find it interesting that my faith as it's evolved has colored my politics: The ethos of "live and let live" is why I now consider myself a libertarian (note the lower-case "l").
BTW, "faith journey" is a term I first heard used back in the 'burg, at the CSA services I attended during my last two years there. I like this term very much.
Yeah, the great thing about "faith journey" is that it implies not being at a destination where everything is settled.
Tyd-- GP may be staid but it DID produce me and you and Bill and Suzy Quatro, so there is something going on there...
Tyd-- GP may be staid but it DID produce me and you and Bill and Suzy Quatro, so there is something going on there...
I am married to a PK?
News to me What is a PK?
Osler, I think you are the best thing to come out of GP since Sherilyn Fenn.
BTW Bill is not from GP He is from southern California.... Dude. He was a surfer from Ventura.
News to me What is a PK?
Osler, I think you are the best thing to come out of GP since Sherilyn Fenn.
BTW Bill is not from GP He is from southern California.... Dude. He was a surfer from Ventura.
# posted by : 5:29 PM
: 5:29 PM
PK = Preacher's Kid
Though I come from a very long line of lawyers, I'm still trying to figure out what "PC" means, in a law school context.
Regarding the "other" definition of "PC," I like what Bill Maher said... "Political correctness is the elevation of sentiment over truth.
Though I come from a very long line of lawyers, I'm still trying to figure out what "PC" means, in a law school context.
Regarding the "other" definition of "PC," I like what Bill Maher said... "Political correctness is the elevation of sentiment over truth.
Sherilynn Fenn? Didn't know that! My hometown claims only Sharon Lawrence and Emily Procter (who went to my high school - her dad was our soccer team's "team doctor"), and Evan Rachel Wood as big celebrities.
OK-- Suzi Quatro is actually Sherilynn Fenn's Aunt, so there is a connection there (it's on Wikipedia). And Tyd, I meant my brother Bill, not your hubby Bill.
OK Osler I did not know that.. maybe you should have addressed him by his new name WILL.
Osler please do not think that I am hate GP because I do not. I mean, I could not possibly hate it, but doesn't everyone have a little bit of a love/hate relationship with their home town? HOW could I hate a town with a pink and green jail?
Osler please do not think that I am hate GP because I do not. I mean, I could not possibly hate it, but doesn't everyone have a little bit of a love/hate relationship with their home town? HOW could I hate a town with a pink and green jail?
# posted by : 7:40 PM
: 7:40 PM
Tyd-- Oh, I didn't think that. Here's a fun GP fact: An inmate at the GP Shores jail gets (or, at least, used to get) food from the Grosse Pointe Yacht Club across the street. And, no, I don't know that from being an inmate at the Grosse Pointe Shores jail...
WOW!!!! I am going to GP Shores to try to get arrested. What is it about "club food" that is so good? We used to belong to the Detroit Boat Club, back when it was not inhabited only by rats. There is just something about sitting in plastic chairs in a wet bathing suit totally sunburned with your friends that makes anything you eat from those clubs taste way better than anything.
I did not know that. I did know that at the GP Woods jail they got stuff from the horrible greasy spoon place on Mack called I think "Steak and Egg Kitchen or something.." and no I was not in there ever. I spent a year as a crossing guard.
In fact two of my little safety kids on my corner are now lawyers.
I am soooo old.
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I did not know that. I did know that at the GP Woods jail they got stuff from the horrible greasy spoon place on Mack called I think "Steak and Egg Kitchen or something.." and no I was not in there ever. I spent a year as a crossing guard.
In fact two of my little safety kids on my corner are now lawyers.
I am soooo old.
# posted by : 11:58 PM
: 11:58 PM << Home
